I know this is an older topic, but a good one. I admit to being enamored of the huge parts count kits, but as I get older, that love is tempered with reality. I am beginning to realize that with all that detail comes an investment of time that I don’t want to make. I have so many models in my stash now that I know I won’t get to build as it is, and more come out all the time that capture my interest…and my money. I still buy the large part count kits, but it’s more the subject matter than the detail that interests me. Tamiya makes a great kit, and I fairly recently completed their most recent 1/48 Spitfire Mk. 1, which was great. I presume their newer 1/48 Bf109 G-6 will be a similar build experience, not overly complex. But there are some things that Tamiya does not do that I find important. For example, their 1/48 F-14D, while by all accounts, a stellar model, does not include posable control surfaces on the wings, which is something I really want, hence, I have both the Tamiya and the AMK F-14D kits, so I can experience both the build experience of Tamiya, and get the detail I want out of the AMK. If Tamiya did the control surfaces like AMK did, I likely would not have wanted the AMK kit, also. So now I have both kits. Like TopSmith, I also have the Meng USMC M1A1 AIM kit (2 of them, in fact), plus I have probably 10 other M1A1/A2 kits. The Meng kits looks, by far, to be the simplest build (the others are Dragon and Rye Field). It looks a little too simplistic (I got these kits due to the need for USMC tanks), but I’ll reserve judgement until I finish one. I hope it looks as good when done as the Dragon version, of which I’ve build several. I’ve already noted that the ‘spring’ which holds down the front fenders is molded into the plastic on the Meng, whereas is separate metal parts on the Dragon. I know that little detail will be a noticeable difference. Still, the Meng should be a simpler and faster build. We’ll see. I just wish there was a way to have it both ways, the same level of detail with reduced parts count.
Many good points made here. I think there will come a point where manufacturers are gonna be limited to how much detail they can engineer into a kit
Lol sorry I sent my reply without finishing my thoughts. I think there is definitely a limit to how much more detailed injection mold manufacturing can go before it just can’t anymore for technical reasons and cost. I think we’re gonna hit a wall at some point.
@cabasner Curt, I hear you. Too many models not enough time:)
The classic return for time invested in the model question.
Is it worth spending 2 or 3 times the labor time building a 1,200 part model that has 2% to 10% better detail than a 300 part kit that has 90% percent of the detail that builds in 1/3 the time?
That’s a question each modeler should consider to find their personal “correct answer”
1990’s Tamiya quality plus a little old school detailing with a bit of select aftermarket improvements does the trick for me. Seems to yield about 85 to 95 percent of the detail for less than half the build time. I’d rather build 2 or 3 well detailed models than 1 extremely well detailed model.
I’m a disciple of “Shunkworks” author Ben R. Rich’s view, “That 80 percent today is better than 100 percent tomorrow.” in regard to getting stuff done and models built. For the most part, in contests models are judged on basic construction not fidelity to detail accuracy.
Of course if excellent detail accuracy is the be all end all of importance to a modeler more power to that person.
@metalhead85 - I agree with your point about reaching a limit in molding, but I temper that with the concept that most of us cannot envision what isn’t yet present. I think that most folks couldn’t imagine the parts we routinely get today with slide molding, until slide molding existed and was used for models. I think the same thing goes for ‘regular’ molding. When you look at the utterly spectacular details that are present in 3D printed jet exhausts, for example (and I’m thinking in particular about the F-15 exhausts without turkey feathers) and you see the almost hairlike fineness of the actuating arms, I think there is still a level of molding that can be reached that isn’t common in a ‘regular’ kit. Of course, now you’re talking about the need to very carefully package such models, and other improvements, and the concomitant cost increases for those improvements. But generally, I think you are close to correct in that molding is reaching a certain level of detail that may not be surpassed in the future. There is, however, always room for a manufacturer to improve their engineering and fit, using Tamiya as the standard bearer of best in class.
@Armor_Buff, I agree with all your points. I’m not a competition modeler, so I build strictly for myself, and for the times when I post pictures here in forums. I admit that I love looking at models that I’ve done that have more detail, but then I consider the amount of time it took to get that detail. I do like certain things, though, including scratch building some details that no one else really has done, such as the training hardware, and 3D unit designations, on a Merkava tank turret, of which I am particularly proud. And that took quite a bit of time to do. And the reality is that there is not a lot of real uniqueness in models these days, given that so much knowledge about techniques is available on the internet, and so many folks have gotten so good at building, painting and weathering. So I guess it all depends on what the modeler is going for. Thank goodness there is room for all kinds of goodness in our hobby, eh? 
Yes this is true; a good example of my point would be, how much more detailed can we make a headlight? Or similar parts for that matter. There are of course parts that can be much more detailed than they are now, but at some point you’ll reach a limit on technology . I know it’s all CAD and CNC machines etc but manufacturers have to weigh the pros and cons.
Or to quote Gen. Patton: “A good plan violently executed today is better than a perfect plan next week.” Well, maybe we don’t need the violent part, but you get it.
Ken.
I’ve been working on a Mini-art T-34/85 interior kit for the last few weeks. (I love it by the way). But I totally get cabasner’s thought about the time tradeoff. This is taking a lot of time. That’s not a bad thing but I’m sure I will think about that the next time I consider an interior kit. I’d sort of like to have the new Amusing Hobby T-72 but I don’t really want to do an interior kit.
But one of the things I’m noticing about this Mini-art kit is that some of the delicate parts are broken on the sprue. I thought it might be my handling of it, but I repaired one part that was broken on the sprue and glued it in place yesterday. Today I notice that my repair didn’t hold. There is no stress on that repair where it was glued in place which makes me think there was long term stress on it during shipping and storage. There may be so many parts in some of these boxes that becomes more common? Perhaps a sign of being at, or beyond, the limit?
To be honest my most enjoyable builds were Tamiya kits. I did not struggle with fit issues unless I started a conversion and that was on me not Tamiya. I like to add detail like Sheperd Paine did to Tamiya kits. The complexity is what I made of it.
I did not suggest that better detailed kits were worse, I just enjoyed Tamiya better. I have a since of gratification when I can fabricate a piece of detail and it looks like it was made by Tamiya. I am not a guy who uses every piece of photo etch, and I do not try to add every piece of detail possible. ( I do enjoy watching the build of the super uber detailers and revel in their skill and eyesight however)
I admit I was excited when Dragon first came out with their 800+ parts kit of their Panzer IV E. I managed to get it built. I even added an interior to it. But as the years have gone by I found that kits with 800 to a 1000 parts wore me out. I still get excited by some of the new kits that are coming out only to then get disappointed when I see they are 1000+ parts. Over time I noticed that the Tamiya kits I bought, got started, got finished, and were enjoyable builds. I have no unfinished Tamiya kits on my shelf. I can’t say that about most other manufacturers In the end, the best thing about model building, for me anyways is enjoying the build and actually putting a finished model in my cabinet.
I believe that something missing from a lot of this discussion is “choice.”
The vast majority of these “high parts count” kits are also represented by lower parts count kits of the same subjects. So for most of them, there are other choices.
Also, the number of parts is easily found out by the most superficial review of the kit in question. In short, there is no reason why anyone should be surprised to find a “high parts count” kit in the box when its opened nor any reason for someone who objects to dealing with such a kit to even purchase it in the first place. These are informed decisions and purchases.
Manufacturers, brands and contemporary releases vice older ones are also all indicators of what’s in the box and, by extension, how long the build will take (assuming that all of the parts, such as those for a full interior) are used.
Can anyone here honestly say that they didn’t know ahead of time what they were getting into if they bought one of, say, MiniArt’s newer kits with full interiors? Or a Trumpy kit that shows multi-part track links that have to be assembled while also assembling the track sets as indy-link tracks?
The simple solution for anyone who doesn’t want to spend the time to assembly a “high parts count” kit is to just not buy it to start with. In this day and age of the internet and social media, there are very, very few of us who can we didn’t know just what we were in for when we started any model, especially one of the newer, usually fairly expensive, “high parts count” kits. We made the choice to do so with both eyes open.
You send the wrong consumer message to the manufacturer if you don’t like what they’re selling, yet you still go out and buy it.
Well said @SdAufKla, choice is good. It’s always interesting to read you thoughts on these topics. We are blessed with lots of subject matter. Definitely a lot of 1/35 scale grief can be avoided with good research before buying a kit.
Please consider the following is intended as part of friendly discussion on our topic at hand. Sometimes in written word, I read more brisk than intended.
My choice and defacto message to all kit manufacturers is simple - if the part count is 600+ odds are very low I will buy your new kit.
If the tank model has an interior its almost guaranteed I will not buy the kit under any circumstances. That’s mostly because displaying the interior of a tank so it can be appreciated requires special planning like a Fries Crane, Factory, repair dio, clear hull, cut away, magnets etc.
More power to those that wish to build those models. I’m very happy to observe from the side lines. Had my fill of tanks with hard to see interiors back in the day thanks to Jaguar, Verlinden & my own scratch building.
I think Takom is very wise to spin off their Panther kits with interiors as Das Werks Panther kits without interiors. That’s a perfect example of a win win for all modelers choice. It’s a move that should gain much respect 
. I will probably buy a couple of Das Werks Panthers:) If they are outstanding, I might eventually consider a Takom Panther.
One exception taking an ~1,100 part kit and tossing the ~600 to 700 part kit tracks in the trash. Often the kit tracks can be replaced with less fiddly to build aftermarket track options. Three to six parts for each track link? No thanks. My time is too valuable for that sort of boring monotonous repeative motion task. I think feedback is worth while for manufacturers to know.
It tickles me that not many years (decades?) ago our community was crying out for more detail than Tamiya would give us! Dragon was first to seize on this trend, with all those Shermans and Panzers that went for big money. But as soon as we got it we started moaning. Workable indy-link tracks? Kit makers aren’t making them because they want to - they do it because we asked. Same with all that fiddly PE - somebody wanted it so that’s what we get. Personally I don’t let it get in my way - I’ve been building kits long enough now to cope.
I just received a Hobbyboss truck kit with loads of parts, and while it’ll take a little longer to build I am not looking to replace it with a simpler Tamiya or Italeri kit anytime soon. And having kit interiors saves me the effort of scratchbuilding them! But that’s just my opinion - yours may be different. Bear in mind our whole community of modellers represents but a fraction of the buying market out there, so regardless of our thoughts the makers will do what they think will sell the most…
Well, sure. This is just the point I was trying to make.
I have no beef with anyone who would prefer simpler and quicker builds with fewer parts. I, myself, often follow up long, drawn out projects with something more or less right out of the box, often as not a Tamiya kit. (I personally think of these as “decompression” builds. A lot of them I also use to practice some new technique or material on…)
I just find the way that many of these sorts of discussions evolve very… curious? When I’m reading comments someone has made about how some kit has too many parts and how tiresome they’re finding it, I just have to ask myself, “Didn’t this guy know that kit 1000+ parts before he bought it? Surely he had to have realized that it was a “high parts count” kit when he opened the box and looked at it…”
I find it hard to muster much sympathy for someone who made the choice to buy the kit and then start it when he or she “suddenly discovers” that they’re not having any fun. I mean, why would someone start something like that when they already know they won’t enjoy it? What’s the point?
Sure, I’ve readily taken on some modeling projects that I knew were going to stretch the limits of my patience and skills, projects that I knew were going to be… challenging, to say the least. But that was my choice. I willing took the build on, many times just because I wanted that challenge. I’d feel bad if I then started complaining about how hard the build was or how long it was taking. I guess I just don’t understand how someone can open up a kit box and feel “surprised” that it has 1000+ parts and then still start it, all the while complaining about how long it’s taking to finish.
Exercise a little self-awareness about what you do and don’t find enjoyable and then choose wisely how you spend your discretionary hobby time.
In short: If it ain’t fun, don’t do it (and also don’t begrudge those others who might find it enjoyable their own fun…)
I must be a strange person, I always swap out the one-piece tracks for indy-links if an indy-link set exists.
Not because I’m a masochist or have a deep personal addiction to small fiddly parts, I just want to be sure that the soft material doesn’t disintegrate a few months after I parked the finished model in the display cabinet.
Its such a subjective question. One persons fun is another persons hell
I switch back and forth. Multi thousand piece kits with tons of PE and AM (usually ship model kits) followed by a nice easy Tamiya kit or something.
I know when I started building in earnest I was obsessed with PE and aftermarket. I bought it for the sake of buying it. But I after a while I started asking who I was building for? Was that super detailed piece really necessary? How much difference is there in the part from 2 feet away? I started being way more selective in what I bought. I have learned what is fun for me.
As for tank tracks, I despise overly engineered multi-part tracks. If I see a kit has 1200 pieces and 800 of those are for the track then I will not buy the kit. I don’t mind indi-link if they are single piece like Dragon Magic tracks etc.
I also research the hell out of kits before I build them. Look at reviews, finished builds, scans of the instructions so I know exactly what I am getting into when I build it. No impulse buys for me ( well almost none 
)
Personally my idea of ‘good enough’ has always been what i feel is ‘good enough’. If I want to make a simpler tamiya kit, then I’ll do that, and if I want something more complex I’ll pick something more complex. Likewise with PE and after market tracks. If I want them I’ll get them.
Whenever I buy a kit I always check online to see if it’s what I want from a kit, looking at reviews and finished builds and the like. Even on impulse buys (which obviously outnumber my intended purchases) I’ve always gone for brands that I’ve at least heard about and have a decent reputation. As a result I feel like it’s been a very long time since I opened a box and was unpleasantly surprised by what i’d got
I build to what strikes my modeling “funny bone” at the time. Now, “when” I build it, is another thing. I only build 1/35, having enough kits in the stash to outlive me. I order what I want, when I want it, money is no object. I want that kit in the stash, and available, whenever I wish to decide that its time to build it. I’ve been ‘burned’ by my own negligence over the years when I saw/found a new kits/aftermarket, and passed up on it. Same goes for PE, resin, aftermarket, metal tracks and/or turned barrels. Interiors? Not a fan. Simple or complex? Again, whatever hits the modeling funny bone. In any case, I will never again miss the opportunity to decide on new releases…of anything, at any time. Now, missing notices of a new release? That’s a whole new thread. 
The only tracks I have heard about falling apart are the Dragon DS tracks. So far I have never used them. Nothing against them, I just don’t have any. I have had other 1-piece tracks hold up for 30 years or more. I will selectively use indy-link tracks if the suit what I want to do. What I don’t like are link and length tracks, I have a hard time with those. I will often replace them with vinyl or the indy-links.
Ken.
I had it happen to a Tamiya Centaur, so even the big T isn’t immune.
To be sure though, most are doing OK.