NEWS: New “Ukrainian Army” Vehicle models

Guys,

No need to argue. If you want a fun shake and bake that builds up beautifully and ends with a gorgeous model of something that looks a lot like a Leopard 2A6 then go for the Tamiya. If you want a more challenging build with an accuracy that is a little bit closer to the real thing, go Border if you don’t mind the dodgy instructions. If you want a more challenging build again with a higher level of accuracy again, then go RFM.

Its not hard.

Choosing Tamiya doesn’t give everyone else the right to look down their noses at you as a “knowledge signaller” (like virtue signaling but with more rivets).

I do wonder how many of the self appointed knowledge signaler modeling Gods we see online, having coated off everyone for choosing a model they do not consider “worthy” actually get around to building their much-vaunted alternatives.

Frankly if someone is going to disparage my choice of Tamiya etc and tell me their choice is superior, then build the model and lets see - show us all. Until then its just “look at me” knowledge signaling, isnt it?

This coming from a guy who loves Leopards. I have the Tiger Models 2Evo, 2Revo II, the Italeri 2A5, the old Tamiya 2A6, the Hobbyboss Dutch 2A6NL and Spanish 2E, the Meng 2A7+, have just finished the Border 2A5/6 and is currently working on the RFM Canadian 2A6 as well. I’ll probably pick up the Border Ukrainian 2A6 in due course. Yes it is possible to have all these kits of the same subject and to appreciate them all.

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We are not looking down our noses at those who BUY the Tamiya kit.
We are criticizing Tamiya for peddling something which isn’t quite what
they are labelling it as.
Those who knows about Leopards can make an informed choice (buy the kit
and do whatever corrections they feel that they need/want to do).
The casual modeler doesn’t know and will be proud of his/her Ukrainian Leopard
until they see news footage and realise that their Leopard does not look like
the tank in the news.

There is a huge difference between:
“You are a fool for buying this product”
vs
“You are a scoundrel for selling this product in this manner”

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With regard my statements about pricing, I plead provincialism and cheap bastard shopping skill. :slightly_smiling_face: Prices obviously vary wildly by kit, manufacturer, country of origin, country of purchaser, and vendor. I remain sincerely hopeful that any modeler who wants the kit will find it, somewhere, for a reasonable price.

With regards the definition of accuracy, I agree that accuracy is an objective measure of similarity to a prototype. The more a model resembles the prototype, the more accurate it is. However, when someone participating in this conversation writes ‘accurate enough’ or anything similar, I understand exactly what the person means and require no further clarification.

I think people who strive for accuracy, who push designers to produce models that more closely resemble prototypes, who advocate for better fit, who provide primary reference material to clarify the attributes of a subject, perform a very useful service for all model builders. Without their efforts, despite advances in computer assisted design and manufacturing, models today would look much more like models released 50 years ago. Super models produced today exist, in part, because of their detailed analysis and demands.

While I sincerely hope no one ends up feeling fleeced, I continue to be okay with the people at Tamiya releasing a model from 2003 with new, conjectural decals, aimed at model builders with less modest demands for accuracy. However, I do understand the concerns expressed in this discussion and feel they have merit. The kit description could be more forthright. The model could include parts to build an accurate, 2023 West German Leopard 2A6. I sincerely hope the people at Tamiya see this discussion, consider it, and find a path that makes more modelers happy. They should consider consulting with someone like Gino (HeavyArty) on their next modern armor release of this nature.

Has anyone found any pictures of these vehicles in use? They arrived at the border two months ago but spring thaw in the Ukraine is very poor tank weather. I am curious if they deployed.

Eh….not likely for the average modeler Tamiya is marketing to. The details differences are too small for most to notice.

Thank you Robin for catching the other operative word in my posts. As noted, I’m not going to get this kit as I have plenty of Leopards in my stash already. If I want one of them to be Ukrainian, I’ll choose one that looks close to reality and buy some decals for it.

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I agree, Ryan. Come to think of it, my guess is that Tamiya is mainly targeting its domestic market of casual builders (and their loyal followers there), which is still several times bigger than the North American and European markets combined. Those buyers would enjoy the low price and availability (as well as their customer service). That makes business sense, and those buyers will not care about the details.

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not sure every casual modellers will react the way you think they will, beside casual modellers can do modification too. I also still don’t have any issues with having fictional ukraine war markings.

I know that most of the people here are fairly knowledgeable about the differences and details of the various vehicles, but most people are not. The rest of the world sees things like this:

As for totally mislabeling a model, my favorite from back in the day was when Revell rereleased their U-99 U-boat model as the U-505. And people bought it! You can still get them even!
Ken

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To be fair, a Volvo could easily be misidentified as a tank…

Damon.

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Or, in this case, an armoured money-truck…
Sorry, click the big Logos


(Nearly three decades ago Volvo had the most appropriate sponsors when it ran 850 Estates in the British Touring Car Championship!)

Cheers,

M

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Looks like Rye Field Models is entering the ring as well. My uneducated guess is that this will be the closest version to what the Ukrainians field so far. We shall see.

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Nice.
Includes the 120mm L25 CS version of the main gun.

Tamiya L2A6 is about 2002 - 2012
Border & RFM L2A6s are about 2009 - 2019
the 2023 announcement from Revell should have the needed parts, but is an A6M’+'.

I think this is their start into what will probably be three to six tank kits. I think they’re pretty much good to go with the Abrams kit, and not real sure about the Challenger kit. I sorta hope down the road that they will do the Polish Leopard as it’s a little different. Plus we know they are probably going to send them some M88’s; if they already haven’t sent them. Now we need a Ukrainian M109a6.

Lastly: have you heard anything about Ukrainian Bradleys being kitted?
gary

Yup, we’ve already sent them w/the Bradleys and other equipment in late Feb. They appear to be standard M88A1s, even though the caption below says M88A2, the pic shows and M88A1.


“M88A2 Hercules armored recovery vehicle in the German port of Bremerhaven, February 2023.”

I have heard nothing on any Ukraine Bradley kits.

boy AFV has really dug into my check book! I see no end to this. I look for a Ukrainian M109a6 to come from them along with the S. Korean 155mm howitzer (rumor has Korea sending a few)
gary

I do not know if any of the offerings look like the photos coming out of the Ukraine yet.



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AFAIK the second picture is a Photoshoped one…

H.P.

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Old topic renewed. Depending on modelling skill and personal detail and accuracy needs now there is something not only re-boxed with fantasy parts.
PSM brought this conversion sets for Leopard 2A6 of Ukraine - separated in ex-German Bundeswehr (Ex BW) and former Portuguese / Dutch.

Some parts are for detailing and updating the basics anyhow. But the special UKR-parts indicates first class references.
It’s for Tamiya resp. Tamiya and Revell, but I will give RFM or Border a try.

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I am very late reading this thread. As you can see I’m just now up to May’s posts. I have avoided it until now precisely becasue of many of the issues already mentioned. Of course model companies are quick to put out what they can. Most are aimed at the unwashed masses, and that’s fine. If you’re an expert and know better, then feel free to make corrections. Or you can wait, or build as is and call it “close enough.”
I do find the discussion a little comical, as at least one “expert” opinion on here as to what qualifies as accurate is very questionable in my mind. But I won’t hash that over again. Apparently I was being too nit picky when I brought up missing or incorrect details, but now it’s okay to. As for a kit being the wrong version, well, I won’t even go there. :roll_eyes: Some of you know exactly what I’m talking about…

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