Question about S-Boats (E-Boats)

I’ve scrounged up enough figures for “action stations” for the gun crews, but I would like to know the crew complement for torpedoes, and if the torpedoes were just pushed by brute force along the rails into the launch tubes, or was a cable and pulley arrangement used to haul them in. Also was the bow 20 mm. top loaded, or side loaded, and if side loaded, which side? And did the gunner load the gun himself, or did he have a loader…there doesn’t seem to be much room in there for two. This is Revell’s 1/72, BTW.
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I believe a block and tackle was used to load the torpedos into the tubes. I know British crews did it that way. As for the bow gun, it was loaded from the left, as you can see in the photo. Spares surrounded the gun tub. Speaking of the tub, you can see there wasn’t much room. But be aware that it is molded undersized in the Revell kit.

The tub in the larger 1/35 S-boat is also too small, this photo shows the corrected tub in the one I’ve been working on.

I hope this helps.

I think the Revell forward gun tub is correct, or very close. There is at least room for the gunner behind the gun, and a pretty tight squeeze for a no. 2. The Italeri one is ridiculously small, with the gunner having to sit on the edge of the tub. In your above pic there is only a single person in the tub, so did the gunner do his own reloads? If so, it must have been awkward for him to grab a mag and slap it into the L. side of the gun. Also, do you you have the number of men on each torpedo crew?
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Sent you a PM with a couple of pictures.

Cheers,
Colin

Looking at that photo, I noticed that there is a helmet on the far side of the gun from the man in the tub. It would seem that would indicate that a second man would be there to act as loader. As to the torpedos, they were usually fired from the bridge, but a man might’ve been stationed there, in case of a malfunction. The tubes on the American Elcos usually had a man stationed next to them with a mallet, in case the firing circuit didn’t work. :beer:

I noticed that helmet, too, but I assumed it was the gunner’s helmet as he is wearing a toque. As to torpedo crews, out of a crew of 25 (or so) once they are accounted for; (engine crew [2 - 3], radioman [1], wheelhouse crew [maybe 2], bridge crew [3?], navigator [1], and guns [total 9?]), there’s at least 6 men left unaccounted for. I was thinking that each torpedo tube was assigned it’s own crew of about 3 men. I realize that this is nit-picking, or rivet-counting :face_with_open_eyes_and_hand_over_mouth:, but, as in any modeling, you want to get the right number of men at their respective posts.
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I’ve read that too, about US PT boats needing a guy to whack the compressed air cartridge to fire the torpedo in case of a failure, but US boats all had pre-loaded tubes, and didn’t require a dedicated crew. S Boats needed a crew to reload the tubes, just as in U-Boats.
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Here are a couple of other photos.

Single operator. Looks like he loaded for himself.

…with a friendly loader but no ready rounds surrounding the tub.

440a1559b42847bb07cbd3c7d8804ef7

I also assumed the helmet in the previous photo (second post) belonged to the gunner and he was just keeping it close at hand. Trying to dig around in the gun tub for it might be a bit of a trick in an emergency. But that might just be my zipperhead brain having a flashback.

Hope someone can chime in with a definitive answer for the crew assignments.

Thanks. I guess I can squeeze two guys in the tub (rub-a-dub-dub, 2 men in a tub). There’s a 2 man gun crew in the KfZ 222 armored car, and they have a similar gun. Tight fit.
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I suggest you consult E-Boat vs MTB by Gordon Wliiamson. There are two photos of torpedo reloading both using 5 crew. The torpedo is pulled forwards by thin cable that disappears off camera so theres either more crew on the cable end or it goes to a winch/capstan.
I think the two photos show different 20mm mounts, the first is shoulder controlled, the second appears to be a mechanical elevation control. This matches with the description in the same book. Early E boats had only a 7.92mm MG38 or MG42 forward which was later replaced by 2cm MG C/38. On pg 26 it explains ‘A special version of the 2cm MG Flak was made solely for use on the bow gun position of later-model E-Boats. Known as the Drehkranzlafatte, it featured a very distinctive pantograph-style mount for the gun-sight. It was manned by a crew of two.’. A google search for ‘Drehkranzlafatte’ brings up the photos.
Hope this helps.

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No expert, but 25 men seems like a lot. One source I was able to find says it was 18, which sounds more likely to me. The Kriegsmarine had craft larger than the S-boats that were classed as Torpedo Boats, this might be the cause of some confusion among certain sources. I always thought that if they needed to reload the tubes, they would retire to safer waters and various members of the crew would then have to pitch in to do the reloading. :beer:

I seem to remember a ship’s bell hanging from a bracket at the back of the superstructure/navigation room, and near the flagstaff. I can’t find this reference anymore. Can anyone confirm this detail?
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This one?

Yeah…something like that! :slightly_smiling_face: Thanks.
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There is a narrow metal ladder from the main deck to the narrow strip of decking beside the armored kalotte, just barely visible in front of the first German seaman. When deployed in the down position, it blocks loading of the torpedoes. How is the ladder stowed when in action? Is it hinged and flip up and lie flat on the upper deck, or does it stow flat against the superstructure?
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Sorry Leo,

I don’t have any pictures of that ladder in it’s stowed location. The way the top curves would make it difficult to hinge and secure so I expect it’s removed and stowed when the boat prepares for action. The less clutter on the decks the better.

I really need to organize my references. Somewhere around my place are at least 2 more books with good schnellboot photos. If I find any informative info I’ll send it to you.

I did find another view of the ships bell. Hope it’s useful.

Cheers,
Colin

Just to muddy the waters a little more…

@Taffy3 's photo of the forward gun tub looking aft shows a crew member standing on the starboard ladder while the boat is at sea, so maybe the ladders were left in place except while torpedoes were being loaded.

But…that photograph is documented as S-65 on a training cruise on the Baltic Sea as part of the 10. S-Boat-School-Flotilla in the summer of '44. So maybe it’s just left in place for training purposes?

Noting that these boats were designed to strike hard and fast and “get out off Dodge”, I would think that getting forward to aid an injured crewman or repair damage/put out a fire would be more important than losing 60 seconds removing and stowing a ladder for a torpedo reload. Attack - disengage - reload - attack.

Of course I could be missing something blindingly obvious that would clarify everything - wouldn’t be the first time.

So if you’re wanting to do a torpedo reload on your build you’re probably safe setting the ladder aside somewhere it won’t be underfoot or disappear over the side. With small boat sailors being the creative/resourceful/superstitious bunch that they are :grin: , odds are pretty good that every crew did it slightly differently anyway.

Having clarified precisely nothing - I think I’ll go back to my gardening.

Cheers,
Colin

Hmmm…that German crew look WAY too happy for surrendering! :wink:
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