Does that comment imply that I shouldn’t believe You either?
Wikipedia has this to say about Iranian tank purchases:
Iran– 60 T-54s and 65 T-55s were ordered in 1981 from Libya and delivered in 1981 (aid, the vehicles were previously in Libyan service). 120 T-55s were ordered in 1982 from Syria and delivered in 1982 (the vehicles were previously in Syrian service). Iran also bought a number of Tirans from Israel during the Iran–Iraq War Some vehicles were captured from Iraq during the Iran–Iraq War
When it comes to Iraq Wikipedia has this to say:
Iraq – 250 T-54s were ordered in 1958 from the Soviet Union and delivered between 1959 and 1965. 50 T-54s were ordered in 1967 from the Soviet Union and delivered in 1968. Between 80 and 120 T-54s were lost during the Yom Kippur War. 300 T-55s were ordered in 1973 from the Soviet Union and delivered between 1974 and 1975. 50 T-54s and T-55s were ordered in 1980 from East Germany and delivered in 1981 (the vehicles were previously in East German service). 400 T-55s and T-54s were ordered in 1980 from Poland and delivered between 1981 and 1982 (the vehicles were probably previously in Polish service). 250 T-55s were ordered in 1981 from Egypt and delivered between 1981 and 1983 (the vehicles were previously in Egyptian service). 150 TR-580s were ordered in 1981 from Romania and delivered between 1981 and 1984 (the vehicles were delivered via Egypt). 400 T-55s were ordered in 1981 from the Soviet Union and delivered between 1982 and 1985 (the vehicles were from the Czechoslovakian production line). Around 200 T-54s and T-55s were upgraded to T-72Z standard (not to be confused with Iranian T-54/55/Type 59 modernization Safir-74 also known as T-72Z) 1,500 T-54s, T-55s and TR-580s were in service with the Iraqi Regular Army in 1990 and 500 in 1995, 2000 and 2002. 406 T-54 and T-55 were in service with Iraqi Regular Army in 2003. All destroyed or scrapped except for 4 T-55s which are now in service with the New Iraqi Army. 76 T-55s are in service with New Iraqi Army. 4 VT-55As were ordered in 2005 from Hungary and delivered in 2005 (aid, the vehicles were previously in Hungarian service). Iraq also received 2 JVBT-55As in 2005 from Hungary.
Doesn’t look as if Iraq gave their T-54’s to others since they kept buying new ones, doesn’t look as if they bothered with the differences between T-54 and T-55 or which production batches or factories they came from.
I do think I trust the mutual infighting and correction mania at Wikipedia more than a single voice on the internet.
Some people may not have access, so the line in question states “Iraq had roughly 3000 tanks at thr our break of the war, mostly comprised of Soviet T-54,T-55, and T-62”
Do you think the editors of Jane’s Armour & Artillery 1987-88 were also using Wikipedia as a source when they wrote that both T-54 and T-55 were in service with Iran and Iraq?
Would have been strange if either of the countries had given away their T-54/55 earlier and then purchased T-54/55’s again …
Just wanted to provide you with another source regarding the numbers and types of tanks being discussed here. These are from the International Institute of Strategic Studies ‘The Military Balance 1988-1989’.
These are direct quotes from the book under the ‘MBT’ headings for each country.
Regardless of who has which, I have some head logic about which model of T-54 could be more plausible based on T-54 production/historical info.
The T-54-3, aka T-54 mod 1951… it is obviously introduced in 1951.
The T-54A was introduced in 1954, this one can be identified with a smoke extractor at the end on the gun. The other differences are nut counting The T-54A feature single plane stabilizer.
Then you have the T-54B, introduced in 1957, it has two planes stabilizer. The exterior differences are insignificant. This is the most common T-54 model of all T-54.
Older models can also be upgraded to B model, especially the A model since they are pretty much the same tank. The -2 and -3 were upgraded to B standard, but some with counterweight instead of fume extractor on the end barrel, so the differences are still recognizable. Most if not all T-54 was upgraded in the early 1960s because the technology was too beneficial. The older were already out of of production as soon as the A appeared, for production efficiency.
By the time of the Vietnam War, Soviet were already exporting A and B models. They had the more advanced T-55 tanks and were making inventory for the more superior T-64 and T-72.
So by the late 80s I doubt the Soviet even had any mod 1951 left in store. The even China started their Type 59 with the T-54A, and exported Type 59 by late 1960s to Vietnam.
I’d like to get my hands on good reference material on both the T-54 and the T-55. I picked up Cookie Sewell’s book on the T-55 and while it is a great book, it’s not all that helpful identifying variants. Right now the best reference material I have access to seems to be the miniart kit instructions for the different variants - hopefully they are getting things right.
You can use this site for some info about the details of the T-54, wrote by armor enthusiastic people, basically collect info like us. Though, there are some very minor and unimportant details that left out, like different turret light mount on… the T-54B after 1963 has same/similar front light as T-55… which is pretty much nut counting detail.
Rule 143.58 States " All parties in a duel are required to bring their sources. Their second must cancel the duel if the duelist arrives empty handed."
First off, you don’t know me so you don’t know what I would or wouldn’t do. I’ve admitted plenty of times in my life when I was wrong. Maybe if you weren’t so busy trying to sharp shoot me you just might learn a thing or two. Maybe you’ve learned a couple things here. One, the difference between a T-54 and a Type 69, and two the fact that not everything on the internet is true.
