I’ve got this set of figures
https://www.scalemates.com/kits/dragon-6375-tank-crew--108437
Is there any reason I couldn’t use them as Heer panzer crew in Normandy 1944? Specifically for 116th Panzer Division?
2 Likes
Maybe swap out some of the heads with some with 1943 Field cap:
5 Likes
No reason why not. You could swap some of the heads, but it’s not really necessary.
3 Likes
Thanks guys, I thought this was the case but Dragon specifying '39-'43 got me wondering if I’d missed or my reference books were missing some important uniform information!!
1 Like
Okay, someone school me on this… The figure set depicts a WSS Panzer Crew in their signature black tunics and wraps. Wehrmacht tank crews would be dressed similarly, but their uniforms would be field gray and have the pink piping on the shoulder boards to denote them as panzer crewmen? Or did both the Wehrmacht and WSS Panzer crews wore black uniforms?
1 Like
@Chepster, The main difference between earlier and later uniforms was the headgear. Prior to 1941, the panzer crews wore the padded berets. After 1943, as mentioned above, the M1943 cap was introduced. I’m sure that more than one veteran tanker still wore their sidecap though.
@SableLiger, Black uniforms with pink piping were worn by both SS and Heer Panzer crews. They were a separate branch. Field gray uniforms with red piping were worn by Sturmgeschutz and Panzerjager crews. They were artillery branch. There was also a slight difference in the cut of the tunics worn, one went farther to the side than the other type.
2 Likes
From photos of tanks and crews in Normandy there is a real mix of headwear - side caps, 1943 field caps and crusher service caps. Unfortunately there doesn’t seem to be a huge amount of photos of 116th PD in Normandy - I suspect because, by the time they arrived, the Germans were already on the back foot so taking photographs was probably not a high priority.
2 Likes
The picture I’m looking at doesn’t show the Black Panzer uniform at all and this is clearly a Waffen SS tank crew. First three on the left are wearing the Waffen SS Camouflaged Reversible Coveralls introduced in early 1943, first seen in photographs at Kursk. It seems to have been a popular item, especially amongst Stug crews. The other two appear to be wearing the standard Denim Drill working uniform, which was issued to all ranks for dirty work. This may indicate that they are mechanics rather than part of the crew, but they may just have been doing maintenance.
What further confuses the issue is that the Heer issued a set of Panzer Denims, in the same cut as the Black Panzer clothing, but in a reed green colour. It was very popular, especially with recce units. It’s main distinguishing feature was a large patch pocket on the left chest. Otherwise it would appear that Heer crews continued to wear the black clothing throughout the war. SS crews tended to favour the range of camouflaged uniforms they were issued with later on and the black clothing is quite hard to find in late war pictures of SS crews. There is a well known sequence of photos taken at a parade of some sort just prior to Normandy. Wittman is present wearing full Black Panzer uniform but the other crews are wearing the two piece Waffen SS Camouflaged Panzer uniform, but fully badged with medal ribbons. This seems to suggest that issue of the black clothing was in abeyance, but those who possessed it could wear it for parades or walking out.
5 Likes
It’s a bit of a misnomer. The figures on the box really cover mid 1940 to the end of the war. Originally, panzer crew were issued with the large floppy beret which covered the “schutzmutze” crash helmet and this was still being worn in 1940. However, despite its protective function, this item proved very unpopular and was replaced by the side cap shown. There was a shortage of these in black initially, so photos from the French Campaign in 1940 often show black uniform and field grey cap.
2 Likes
Glad I’m not the only one who thinks Dragon got the description slightly wrong. I might throw in a couple of 1943 caps for variety and maybe even…a bare head!!
1 Like
The three fellows on the left seem to be wearing the one-piece coveralls of 1943 (Dragon makes a set of these) supposed to be reed-green but on my browser look khaki. I believe the same uniform was issued in SS camo.
2 Likes
You may be right. But I felt that I could detect mottling on the overalls of the TC (left) who is an Unterscharfuhrer if SS, particularly on his right upper arm and left leg. The guy second left seems to have clear mottling on his left leg, which led me to believe they are SS. Dragon do indeed do a set of figures wearing these coveralls, entitled “LSSAH, Kursk, 1943”, which once again is misleading as they were worn until the wars end. The working denims worn by the two guys to the right were originally issued in a white/grey cement colour, but the SS dyed them reed green. They were supplanted by the M1944 two piece camouflaged suit.
1 Like
I too was wondering if the overalls were camouflage mottled or just dirty
2 Likes
i ran the picture through Affinity Photo and tweaked the brightness and contrast. To me it looks like the two guys on the ledt are wearing coveralls in Oakleaf camo, the middle guy in possibly Planetree camo coveralls. The forth and fifth are in Planetree camo, but those uniforms would be made by tailors outside the SS supply system.
4 Likes
Is this an original color photo, or somebody’s colorized version of a black & white photo? My guess says that its the latter…
1 Like
My money is on colorized. The software never gets faces right.
1 Like
Nope.
1 Like
Nevertheless it’s a photograph that tells a story of a hard worked group of soldiers. They certainly look like the bottle shown on the box art would have been greatly appreciated.
Watto 
2 Likes
As they say down here in the US… “Rode Hard; Put Away Wet…”
2 Likes
Sounds like something you do with the wife or girlfriend! 
1 Like