came across this in my big box of military trinkets, a USAF Challenge Coin and I have question about it.
in the centre the left half depicts the nose of an MC-130H but what does the right-hand side image depict?
The left 1/2 face of a bird flying at you
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yeah, itâs the right hand face that has me perplexed, I just canât figure it out.
Like Greg said itâs an eagle looking straight at you
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@Littorio at first I thought you have a vivid imagination but I finally saw it in the end.
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I didnât know they were called âChallenge Coinsâ. I was presented one by SACEUR or all people; he clearly thought I was a top bloke (so not really sure he was a good judge of character!)
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The bird is more visible on the badge version
H.P.
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Oh, the 7th SOS out of Mildenhall. Too bad the T2âs are all retired now. They were a pretty cool platform. I was a Crew Chief on them While I was stationed in Okinawa back in the day. Stinks there are no really goo models to depict the Talons and Shadows and Compass Call birds.
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@BootsDMS as far as i understand it (feel free to correct me anyone), the âChallenge Coinâ dates back to WW2 when US bomber crews would take out a dollar bill and write their names on each others bill. when they went out drinking someone would issue a challenge by producing their signed dollar bill and all the other members would have to produce their respective dollar bills, the person that failed âthe challengeâ got hit with the bar bill that night. Now if everyone produced their dollar bills, then the person issuing the challenge got stuck with the bar bill for the evening.
there was an interesting story about this when a woman produced her grandfathers dollar bill and asked one of these tv auction programs what it was worth. he looked at at it and offered her a small amount of cash for it as it had an interesting story attached about her grandfather was one of the crew on a WW2 bomber. She though the guy was offering way to low a price and asked him surely it was worth more than that as it had Clark Gables signature on it as he was the pilot for that crewâŚneedless to say that particular dollar bill became a lot more valuable.
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Thatâs very interesting; I just thought they were a commemorative piece and that was that.
I knew of them having worked with the US a fair bit on exercise and in the NATO HQ I was posted to, but you could have knocked me down with a feather when I got mine. I mean, admittedly only doing my job, but the head of NATO - SACEUR! I mean, wow.
Just for the record, this was in Bosnia-Hercegovina c.1998.
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I do have a USN VF-101 F-14 Tomcat challenge coin that I had put into a frame with a load of different F-14 squadron patches.
Also got a RAF Sepecat Jaguar coin but that one is just a collectors coin that just happens to look and be the same size as a challenge coin.
Two of my all time favourite aircraft and a fan of what was the fleet replacement F-14 squadron and briefly resurrected as VFA-101 on the F-35.
No challenge coins around for my other favourite two aircraft though, Bristol Beaufighter and Fw-190!
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Iâve heard different versions over more than forty years.
The first, and most convincing to me - After WWII when Special Forces was created, many of the members were from Eastern Bloc countries - Poles, Czechs, uzw. (I missed having a former Wehrmacht soldier on my team by one year) If you were sitting at a bar and noticed someone who had that look about him, you werenât always sure who he was. So the challenge coin was created. You slapped it down in front of him. If he was a brother, he produced his own. This evolved into challenging a whole group with your coin. And if it accidentally fell out of your pocket while you were fishing for something, and hit the ground, that counted as a challenge - the notorious âcoin dropâ challenge. Any member who could not produce his coin owed everyone else present a round. If everyone did have their coin, the challenger owed the group a round.
I personally saw guys challenged in the shower. (this usually didnât happen unless shenanigans had gone too far) who had them in their mouths, or in one case, a guy had his between his butt cheeks. That I did not actually witness, thankfully.
The other version is that during WWI a British pilot got shot down behind enemy lines, and as he was trying to return he was challenged by a sentry. Unable to prove who he was, he said, Iâve got a coin from (insert name of university here), and one of the sentries supposedly said, âI went to school there!â They let him through, and discovered he was legit. Not as plausible to me, but you never know.
What I do know is that the challenge coin thing evolved into something far more than it was originally intended. Leg commanders would make a big deal of presenting them to soldiers who did well on this or that. We simply called it doing your job. The SF way is to simply shake the soldierâs hand, passing it to him while doing do.
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Thatâs what happened to me; I thought âWhat the hellâs this"?â
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I found this, close to what I remembered:
- According to the legend, the first challenge coins were minted in World War I for a U.S. Army Air Service flying squadron. A wealthy lieutenant commissioned bronze medallions (sometimes described as âcoinsâ) bearing the squadron emblem or insignia, and distributed one to each pilot. Defense Media Network+2gallagher-westfall.com+2
- In one version of the story, a pilot carrying his coin in a small leather pouch was shot down behind enemy lines. When captured, his uniform and all personal identification were taken â though the coin was overlooked. U.S. Department of War+2MilitaryCoinsUSA+2
- Later he escaped, reached a French outpost, but was mistaken for a German saboteur (he lacked proper ID). Facing execution, he produced the coin. Because a French soldier recognized the squadron insignia, he was spared. Defense Media Network+2Air Combat Command+2
- After his safe return, the squadron began habitually carrying their medallions â and reportedly, the informal tradition of âchallenge coinsâ began: fellow servicemen would test each other, demanding proof of affiliation (i.e., produce the coin) or pay a round of drinks.
This version has been largely debunked - how would they miss the coin during a search? That, and there are no records of any such coins being issued.
Another source:
One can reasonably treat the coin tradition among Special Forces (including 1st SFG) as beginning in the Cold War period (late 1950s â 1960s), as part of formalization of unit identity, cohesion and esprit de corps. The use of coins for identity, loyalty, or informal âchallengesâ may well have started around then (or slightly earlier), especially in groups with multinational or multilingual composition such as early Special Forces.
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Odd what happens sometimes. I was looking for the Slovenian Special Forces coin Iâd been given and found this old piece of paper from when I was learning Slovenian. Note the circle. Whatever happened to that guy? I have my theories, but I doubt anyone will admit to it. Great modeler, by the way,
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Iâve been retired since â93 but I always have my group coin in my pocket.