1/48 B-17F Build - 303rd BGs Luscious Lady {Continued)

[Redhand]

@Dioramartin

It doesn’t show up anywhere on (my) Google search.

You are right. It doesn’t. That’s unfortunate.

This may be a coincidence, but one of my book contributors, the late Mel Schulstad, a pilot of the original 303rd cadre that went to England, told me during an interview of visiting an RAF Bomber Command very early in his tour. (I forget the circumstances under which he came to be there, maybe aircraft trouble that required him to land his B-17 there.)

He mentioned seeing an RAF bomber that had returned from a mission with a shattered tail turret and seeing the grisly remains of the gunner left inside. He referred to it as “something that had once been a human being.” He said that it made a powerful impression on the seriousness of the business they were engaged in. While he was quite a raconteur, he was dead serious about this story, a painful memory.

Here’s a bit about him narrated by his son. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6LN3LnjwHZ4&ab_channel=JoshDobbins. And here’s more about the aircraft and crew.

[Dioramartin]

Very moving, another life-or-death fluke that Mel was grounded with flu just before his first crew’s fatal mission in Jan ‘43. I’ve just revisited the Lanc turret photo, caption says it was caused by night-fighter fire (not flak, my bad) during a raid on Oberhausen on 14th June ’43. His description of Haynes certainly matches Dad’s – in assessing the damage, bizzarely Dad’s superior asked him if he thought the shattering plexiglass had contributed to the man’s “condition”. Considering the 20 or 30 bullet/canon shells through the turret, he thought not.

Lest we forget, it’s Remembrance Day today.

Assuming Mel remained at Molesworth throughout 1943, it’s around 90 miles south of Scampton – a fair distance and not forgetting severe fuel rationing in those days. Not inconceivable though, he might have been part of an official or semi-official USAAF visit to the Dambusters’ base (being only a month after that raid) and seen that very same aircraft. On the other hand shot-up rear turrets would have been a tragically commonplace sight.

Dad was also encouraged by the Air Commodore to cover in his memoir another taboo (alongside airfield accidents) known then as LMF or Lack of Moral Fibre. He was very reluctant to write about it so only mentioned a few examples, and tried to differentiate genuine cases of psychological breakdown from the various shades of cowardice. Groundcrew officers had to investigate recurring examples of repeated & inexplicable technical faults (otherwise they & the mechanics themselves were in big trouble) especially when experienced by a suspect crew, typically occurring on engine start-up or during taxiing for take-off. There was a neat trick involving “mag-drop” which could be temporarily initiated by the pilot, enough to ground the aircraft & abort the mission…and incidentally endanger ground crew thus forced to un-bomb it. Officers like Dad had to be ready to slip into the plane & catch the pilot in the act – an awful situation would ensue if busted, as you might imagine, for everyone involved.

Anyhow I’ve taken up too much of your space already, how’s H.G. going?

[Redhand]

@Dioramartin

Anyhow I’ve taken up too much of your space already, how’s H.G. going?

Quite the contrary! Your comments are remarkable.

Schulstad was a larger-than-life character. The loss of his crew early on was a huge blow to him, and he “took to drink.” But being old pre-war Army Air Corps, he sucked it up and served throughout the war with the 303rd, right through to the end, flying 44 missions. And he was career Air Force through to retirement.

His second career was as a substance abuse counselor. See Remembering Mel Schulstad:

He served as a colonel in the U.S. Air Force. He was an addiction counselor at a time when society didn’t know what that meant. He co-founded the professional association for addiction counselors. And he was an advocate for people suffering with substance use disorders and the professionals who serve them. [My emphasis].

As we say in the innertubes, “Read the whole thing.”

As for HG’s efforts, the next post will show substantial progress. Doing it now.

[Redhand]

Embarrassment of riches: Wings, Fuselage, Tail

If this post has a theme, it is the repair and upgrading of work previously done, especially to make it ready for application of the Olive Drab and Neutral Gray paints seen on the after fuselage.

Let’s start with the wings.

So, what’s wrong with this picture?

HG’s concern was that the primer obscured the scribed rivet detail. See the difference between the rescribed areas indicated in blue below and the rest of it.

And see the effect when the whole thing is rescribed!

Moving to the fuselage, HG resprayed the white bar white where the decal had lifted a bit
and then rescribed it.

Cool as hell! This national insignia color scheme is so emblematic of the period between First and Second Schweinfurt (August-October 1943) that any cognoscente seeing it on a B-17 knows the bomber belongs to the time when the future of “daylight bombing” hung in the balance. It’s the heart of what Half a Wing is about.

On to the radio room exterior.

Of all the fuselage areas I fretted over when the build was in my hands this was the toughest, requiring so much expert re-sculpting beyond my grasp.

The is a WIP (work in progress) shot. I told HG “the Radio Room exterior ‘needs work’” and was told,
“that’s exactly what it’s getting. Gonna look splendid!!!”

So, watch along with me when the time comes.

Now on to the tail.

Obviously, HG is working on the elevators. Here’s an exchange from our collaboration:

HG: There’s too much flex in the horizontal stab parts. Each time they are handled it gives me a coronary * * * . I was going to plug and pin them anyway, but getting those plugs in now will help. One thing I need to know is the location of the access panels. * * * . Please advise.

My response, within moments last night, was this from the B-17F “Erection and Maintenance Manual”:

Not a case of “bottoms up” here.

But, there are gap problems in the elevators and trim tabs, and between the elevators and fuselage mating surfaces. These have to be corrected.

And compare the fuselage clearance between the port and starboard elevators.

The starboard one clearly needs some more work.

While HG is dealing with this, I throw in a small monkey wrench. A parked B-17 typically shows the elevators in a slightly lowered position.

And that’s the way they will look when installed.

[Redhand]

More Pieces of Tail and Other Body Parts

Boeing B-17E and F Model technical guru Karl Hauffe weighs in why we see the elevators in this downward position.

You may or may not remember that the B-17 prototype (Model 299) crashed because of the control locks (and the lack of checklists). In its original form, the elevator lock could be full up, slightly up or full down. If the elevator was locked full up, the control yoke would be all the way back and the pilots would have a difficult time getting in their seats. With it slightly up, you can get in with no real issues. They tried to take off without verifying the controls were free and the airplane started climbing. With the aerodynamic forces, they would not have been able to unlock the control surfaces so it kept climbing until it stalled with predictable results.

The elevator lock was redesigned so that it only locked with the elevators full down. At least this way, if you try to take off, the worst that will happen is the airplane will end up on its nose. An added plus is the control column is all the way forward, making getting in and out a bit easier. There is a handle in the floor just behind the pedestal that locks both the rudder and the elevators. The ailerons have a separate lock that actually runs from the control column to the yoke. Next to the handle for the elevator and rudder locks is one for the tail wheel lock. The tail wheel is unlocked for turns.

This accident is claimed to have been the reason that checklists came into being. As airplane were getting more complicated, this helped prevent people from killing themselves.

See also 30 October 1935.

Anyway, to pick up where we left off, HG is completing the repairs and corrections to LL’s elevators (pirated from a Monogram kit, not the Revell one)

(OMG, he’s got a machine shop!)

and has positioned one of them at the correct angle.

He’s finalizing adjustments on the other

which will include straightening the outer edge here.

It will be cool to see them painted up with faded OD on the fabric and the darker OD on the metal trim tabs.

We now move to the radio room exterior and the area forward over the bomb bay. The following three views are WIP (work in progress) shots.

Moving forward:

No worries about the fit of the cockpit roof. More on that later. (“It’s a surprise, remember?”)

Gradually, the state of work on the fuselage comes closer to the point where HG is near ready to spray final colors.

Next up, real colors to be applied to a wing also.

Stay tuned. “Don’t touch that dial!”

[RDT1953]

Better watch out for postpartum depression when this is finished Brian …

[Redhand]

@RDT1953

Better watch out for postpartum depression when this is finished Brian

Probably not, as HG is going to start Vicious Virgin.

HOWEVER, when I consider that the idea of having a fully-detailed, expertly-built B-17F from Half A Wing first occurred to me when I was writing the second edition of the book in 1998, clearly having the dream realized 23 years later is a big deal. I know I’ll have a strong sense of completion about it – in a weird kind of way like I actually managed to pull off a major life goal.

It’s also important to me that this turned into a collective effort. I’ve talked about that before, so I won’t beat a dead horse.

Meanwhile, there are a few challenges still ahead on this.

[Redhand]

A One-Shot Teaser of Things to Come

Further sayeth affiant not.

I actually saw this remarkable English anachronism in an affidavit I received in my legal practice years ago. (I still can’t get it out of my head!!)

[Redhand]

Wings and Fuselage – Paint, and Moar Paint!

I was up really late last night working my day job (irony intended) so not much commentary coming up, but you really stopped by for the pitchers (phonetic) so here they are, starting with the wings.

The port wing is ready for a top coat of OD, but first, consider the completed riveting.

Also, a reminder that the lower surface grey is the final color, not the primer.

Note that HG has already partially weathered the surface.

Now begins the time-consuming (so HG tells me) task of masking the wing and cowlings for the OD.

Those rivets do pop out, pure eye candy.

Practice tip: the paper towel makes sense–less tape adhesive against the paint.

And now, the topside color after how many years?

HG informs me that:

The wing will darken as the thinner flashes off, plus the clear coat will change and blend the tone. Note the defined rivet and panel lines. A total of 6 milliLiters of paint and thinner for this section.

It gives me a shiver to see that painted wing snug against the fuselage.

Once properly “cured,” this painted wing will get a national insignia like the ones on the fuselage. The same with the stbd. wing, but with a difference. When HD asked:

What decals am I using for the stars and bars? I have ones with the red trim.

These are what he’s talking about.

Or maybe it’s these.

I don’t remember. Anyway, I replied:

Yes, the wing decals with the red borders are the ones to use. However, there is a difference between the decals on the upper and lower wings.

The upper left decal will have the greyed-out star, whereas the lower right one will keep the white star. Both insignia will keep the white bars. To my knowledge, the greying out of the stars was only applied to the fuselage and upper wing insignia.

The reason the bars were not greyed out too is that making the white stars less visible was something tried when the national insignia was just an insignia blue disk surrounding the star.

The re-riveting of the stbd. wing is now complete and soon it will be ready for paint as well.

Finally, HG has put OD on the forward fuselage,

and I am told not to sweat the difference in appearance between fore and aft.

I will close with a shot of the fully painted port wing and fuselage together.

More later! (And I guess I was wrong about the lack of commentary.)

[BlackWidow]

@Redhand

And now, the topside color after how many years?

I think it’s 10 years ago that you started the blog on Aeroscale, Brian. Yes, I think it was 2011.

Edit:
I have to correct myself. Your first post about LL was on Monday, 21. April 2014. So it’s “only” 7 years ago …
AeroScale :: 1/48 B-17F Build - 303rd BGs Luscious Lady

[Dioramartin]

Amazing, seldom has a lady looked more riveting – I really hope the final pghotography can catch in a raking light that exceptional panel-work, underneath as well as topside The OD tone looks just right for scale colour (i.e.a tad lighter than actual) although hard to be sure without some sample daylight shots. So tricky, doubtless you’ve also seen some wartime colour photos where it looks almost brown/khaki but that’s probably due to degraded negatives & dubious reproduction values

[Johnnych01]

I began following this thread (with the occasional comment but admittedly mainly form the sidelines) in the old forums probably 3 or 4 years into the build and was amazed at how much detail was involved and being put into it. Since then and with me still following along in the shadows it has grown more complex and detailed with each update.
Yours and HG’s work, be it from the sprue or the insane scratch building, is to put it mildly - mind boggling. And it must be said, HG does introduce some masterful new techniques and an amazing level of attention to detail, and the ability to correct issues with a stoke of a brush such as the leading edge deicers when you went back and researched it again …

This B17 must surely be the most in depth, realistic, intricate and probably the closest you will ever get to a complete 1 to 1 scale model anyone will ever see.

It is so nice to now see paint being put on, and the decals giving that bit of extra life. I was going to mention some of the things that have stood out, but to be honest, there are just to many. So the cocking mechanism for the ball gunners MGs will suffice, that looked outstanding and again, was such an intricate detail but added so much. But like I said, you could pretty much go back to every update and see a new amazing piece of workmanship moving the build forward.

Your back story about your dad and then also @Dioramartin adding his fathers exploits, just make it all that more interesting.

Phenomenal build and as always, looking forward to more. As a reminder for me, is the completed bird going to museum ? I’m sure I read something in the former site thread about its final place of rest ?

And a last point on my post … to all the rivet counters out there … I dare you … go on, try and count them …

[HGBARNES]

Hi John,

I stopped counting rivets after 400,000 and certainly not counting the re-riveting of the entire project. If anyone deserves a well made B-17 it would the lads who flew in them followed closely by Brian D. O’Niell.

HG

[Johnnych01]

@HGBARNES

If anyone deserves a well made B-17 it would the lads who flew in them followed closely by Brian D.

Well said and

[Redhand]

Wing Decal Details

Of all the posts I’ve done over the past seven years on this build, this for me will probably be the most interesting and satisfying in terms of the sheer historicity and attention to detail we are trying to achieve in this model.

You’ll see why as we (HG and me) get into it.

One source of the aircraft’s history is here, and reads:

History of
B-17 42-5081 / Luscious Lady

Delivered Tulsa 17/9/42; West Palm Beach 17/1/43; Assigned 427BS/303BG [GN-V] Molesworth 15/2/43; took off from RAF Colerne, NI on training mission and involved in landing accident at RAF Filton, 17/10/43 with Dave Shelhamer, Flight engineer/top turret gunner: J.K. Willett, Radio Operator: W.L. Harvie, pass-Capt J.E.Whitaker, Capt M. Supernick, Cpl E.L. Hughes; transferred 1 Base Air Depot, Burtonwood 5/4/44; 419BS/301BG Lucera 7/7/44; {1m} Returned to the USA 4136 BU Tinker 27/4/44; Recl Comp Eglin 3/1/46. LADY/ LUSCIOUS/ LADY. [My emphasis.]

I never met Dave Shelhamer in person, but he and I spoke many times in the 80s when I was researching and writing Half A Wing and he sent me numerous tapes. He joined the 303rd Bomb Group, 427th Bomb Squadron with a replacement crew before “my crew” - that of Robert Hullar - joined the Group just days before First Schweinfurt on Aug. 17, 1943. Shelhamer was a B-17 pilot and a professional photographer in civilian life.

Here’s a picture of him, and if there’s anyone I’ve known in life for whom the now-dated but then very relevant phrase, “a man’s man,” fit, it was him. He was one of the pilots who went head-to-head with the Luftwaffe’s best fighter pilots . . . and survived. And he remained fiercely proud of his skill and service with the Eighth Air Force his entire life.

He is no longer with us, but some marvelous photos he took during his tour are, and they’re essential to the accuracy of the 1/48 replica of the aircraft we are working on. (Wait and see).

As the above history shows, Luscious Lady was “Assigned 427BS/303BG [GN-V] Molesworth 15/2/43” This means the wing national insignia she carried on arrival looked like this,

with the star white at first, and then overpainted gray (on the top port wing and at the waist.) The diameter of the blue circle on the wings was 70", those on the fuselage 50". (Of course, the yellow circles are for B-17s in the MTO during Operation Torch and after, not here.)

I sent HG the above sheet for the grey stars, and this Cutting Edge sheet below.

I added one from KitsWorld for the stencils, which also had red-surround national insignia and a placement guide that HG followed faithfully.

He ran these pictures past me, and you can see that the stencils do their job on wing and fuselage.

However, when it comes to the national insignia on the wings, it’s a different story.

So what’s the problem? It’s per the placement instructions and aesthetically pleasing, is it not?

It is indeed, but it’s WRONG.

Some photographs lie, but this one, taken by David Shelhamer in September 1943 (on a mission to Norway, I believe), doesn’t. It shows 303rd B-17s with the GN squadron code in the foreground and those of another Group Squadron below.

Look at the national insignia on this enlargement.

It is both larger and further back on the wing than the KitsWorld one, not to mention having the grey star. The difference is subtle but real. See below, courtesy of HG.

HG further enlarged the wing insignia enlargement to see if it actually extended onto the aileron, and his conclusion was “no.” I trust his judgment, so we went with this! using the grey star from the first Cutting Edge sheet and placing it on the red-bordered decal of the second Cutting Edge sheet.

And here you see it placed on the wing:

and after a bit of drying and contour setting, Voila!

This also shows HG’s re-riveting, and while there’s obviously more work to do, “You get the picture.”

This placement also accords with other, relatively rare overhead shots of B-17Fs.

An unfortunate from the 94th Bomb Group. (Square A, and if memory serves, taken over Berlin).

Does David Shelhamer’s photo have any other marking secrets to disclose to the discerning viewer (or mad obsessive)? It’s become conventional to see the triangle insignia on the tails and upper right wings of B-17s of the First Bombardment Division all having the same dimensions. And many did.

An unfortunate B-17G of the 384th Bomb Group (Triangle P), which together with the 379th Bomb Group (Triangle K) and the 303rd (Triangle C) made up the 41st Bomb Wing – they always flew together in a Wing “Combat Box.”

However, not all wing triangles were the same size. The 91st Bomb Group had noticeably larger triangles,

and the 303rd’s wing triangles may have been the largest of all, at least in mid-1943. Look closely at Shelhamer’s picture.

There’s some serious measuring and stencil cutting ahead for HG, but I know he’s up to the task!

I have nothing to complain about.

[Dioramartin]

Fascinating update, pls remind me (if previously covered) were the control surfaces all the same colour (and what was that or those colours?), also what happened to LL after January ’46?

[Redhand]

@Dioramartin

also what happened to LL after January ’46?

@Redhand

Recl Comp Eglin 3/1/46

I think this means that the aircraft was scrapped on March 1, 1946. “Recl Comp Eglin” to me translates “Reclamation Completed at Eglin [Air Force Base].”

Eglin is a really old air force base in Florida.

The fabric control surfaces were originally the same colors as the metal parts around them but faded over time.

Glad you liked the post!

[TopSmith]

The texture differences between metal and fabric also lend to a difference in shade.

[Redhand]

Good point.

[Redhand]

Aw G, can you believe it?

For reasons I’ll reveal “in the fullness of time,” HG and I are less than pleased about the KitsWorld decals for the B-17, and for Luscious Lady in particular. You saw some of the issues with the generic national insignia, but the devil is really in the details.

For the record – and this is something any decal manufacturer should know – if you are doing decals for a particular aircraft, you need to get the details right.

It isn’t rocket science to find out from what lot a B-17 is with today’s online and printed resources. The late Roger Freeman devoted a whole book to the subject.

It’s in my library, though I’m a bit shocked to see it selling on Amazon for between $449.50 and $55!! [Yikes!!]

Anyway, you don’t have to spend a cent to go online to see that Luscious Lady was a B-17F-35-BO.

So I was surprised when HG showed me this from the A/C specific decal sheet we have for her:

B-17G-35-BO – Say what?

Because there are other A/C from this sheet properly marked as F models, the error was readily remedied. That is if you’re comfortable working in millimeters.

The fix is in, but Geeze!

On to some good stuff, then something really bad.

OK, let’s go to the stbd side and the Lady herself as she looked in real life (for the umpteenth time, sorry for the OCD).

And here’s a crop of Mark Styling’s artwork from the 303rd Osprey Elite title he and I worked on.

Now, here’s the decal.

The color difference in the bomb artwork I put down to artistic license, but even if the placement of the decal is tilted up slightly in front so that the decal bomb angle is closer to that of the artwork and the real-life pics, I see no way that we can fix the excessive length in the name. It extends to the middle of the forward window, rather than just past the edge.

For the present, I’ll just say I’m working on alternative sourcing of this essential decal. Hell, it’s the name of the aircraft!

More later, of course.