Modelling armour in Ukraine crisis

That’s meanest looking UAZ-3909 to date. :+1:

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UAZ 31514 (with a custom front grille ? ) :

H.P.

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Camo challenge…

H.P.

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Yeah; but take into consideration that they’re trying to get all this done while fighting in underway. You transitioned to the M1 from the M60A1 during “peacetime” and nobody was lobbing artillery shells at you while you’re is class.

Just sayin’

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yeah and not to mention the logistics involved getting it there as well as spare parts, different fuel, ammo, training for the mechanics, tank crew and support crews as well as setting up repair depots and all the other kit. they needed kit now not in 2-3 years time and they knew how to operate T-72’s etc

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Precisely; the Ukrainians already have the infrastructure in place to repair and upgrade Russian tanks, along with trained personnel to do the job quickly and effectively.

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To be fair, they would likely do conversion training in a NATO country, like Poland, rather than in a n area subject to Russian attentions.

Damon.

Maybe so. But the question of logistics still remains. Like i stated earlier; the Ukrainians already have infrastructure in place to build, repair and modernize Russian tanks; they’ve been doing it with their stockpiles of Soviet-era T-64 tanks, which were made in Ukraine during the Cold War era. Setting up repair infrastructure for a completely new armor system will take years, specially when you’re in a war and your available assets are being diverted to the front lines.

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Everything you guys are saying makes sense and had occurred to me too…it really doesn’t make sense for Ukrainian forces to add the M1 so when my friend told me they were already using them in combat I was really surprised and incredulous about it…I don’t know where he got his information from but the only thing I’ve learned about this is that Poland made a deal to send some of it’s tanks to Ukraine while buying M1s for their own army. Whether some M1s end up making it to the conflict at some point will be very interesting to me from a modeling standpoint…but non of that will be possible until Polish tankers are trained with the M1 and they in turn train Ukrainian tankers on how to use the tank too…I know Poland is heavily invested in supporting the Ukraine already so it’ll be interesting to see if that actually happens…

I think the other issue not being addressed, is how well can former WarPact states continue to supply Soviet era tanks to Ukraine? At a certain point, the well is going to run dry. And if the conflict continues, there will still be a need by Ukraine for armor.

My impression is that a lot of the former WarPact nations sold off their fleet of T-72s a long time ago, keeping only what they need for their use (& smaller armies). I don’t get the impression that FREX the Czech Republic has a deep stockpile of T-72s sitting around anymore. It may be that Poland is the only one that does, & at some point they’re going to run out as well (unless they are cranking out PT-91s at the moment, for the Ukraine).

Damon.

Poland is transitioning to new tank platforms, including American M1A2 SEPv3s and M1A2 SA tanks, along with German Leopard 2A5 variants and South Korean K2 Black Panther tanks. So the Poles will transfer a lot of their older T-72s to the Ukrainian Army. Poland is not the only nation sending tanks to Ukraine, Slovenia is also sending Yugoslav-made M84s to Ukraine; in exchange for Germany to provide Slovenia with Leopard 2 tanks and Marder IFVs.

Abrams for Poland - we reinforce the potential of the Polish Armed Forces - Ministry of National Defence - Gov.pl website (www.gov.pl)

Slovenia to Hand Over M-84 Tanks to Ukraine, Get German Leopard and Marder in Return | Defense Express (defence-ua.com)

until i see M1’s in Ukraine actively engaging Russian tanks (pictures/film footage) in Ukraine then i would say your friend has been misinformed or has missunderstood something they have seen or heard.

it could be Ukrainian troops are being trained to use M1’s right now but i wouldn’t expect to see them on the battlefield until next year.

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So the Polish M1 program is a gateway to sending large numbers of M1 to Ukraine as attrition takes a toll?

There is no shortage of M1 tanks, I was reading a few weeks ago that the USMC has completely abandoned the tank…I guess they still had the older version? Not sure but that’s got to be a sizable number of M1 tanks available in surplus sale type conditions. If Ukraine gets a deal on them and they’re available in large numbers then perhaps it might be in their best interest to get into them longterm especially if the conflict drags on, and there is no reason to think it wont…I was reading that putin has started an unpopular draft and that they have plans to double their forces in the Ukraine. All of that means this war is not going away any time soon :frowning:

Matter of fact the war is so unpopular in russia that putin hasn’t even called it a war yet, at least according to what I read online…is that true?

That’s a good possibility. Putin is having trouble keeping the Donbass and the Crimea under his thumb with Ukrainian forces breathing down his neck and retaking large swaths of territory in the East. He recently called for a massive callout of Reserve forces and in response, thousands are fleeing to neighboring countries to avoid being send to war. its gotten so bad, that Finland is closing its border with Russia; Nine European Union countries decided earlier this month to stop [accepting] Russian travel visas, even before Putin’s announcement: the Netherlands, Czech Republic, Poland, Denmark, Belgium, Latvia, Lithuania, Estonia and Slovakia.

My main worry is that Putin is being pushed into a corner; with a losing war in the Ukraine, massive protests at home and the possibility of him being ousted; he will feel justified to do something stupid… Something that will threaten the whole of Europe, and most likely, the rest of the world.

It’s hard to get quality reliable news here in the US, there are so many places producing fake news and things of that sort, sometimes it’s hard to tell what’s what…I don’t know where he got his news from but he was very specific in describing a forward action in a place where the Ukrainians have driven back the Russians. He described an action where a special platoon of Ukrainian M1s had destroyed a large Russian tank force numbering in the 30s from long range…he even said that the tanks were so fresh off the boat that they still had USMC markings on them…like I said before, it seemed so unlikely that it prompted me to post here and to do some independent research of my own and I’ve found nothing to corroborate anything he told me…I’ll have to ask him where he got his information next time I see him…I have learned some surprising things from him in the past as he used to be an independent contractor for the the navy and he had inside information on things well before they became news…so I’m not going to call him out…at least not yet…

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Russian Navy T-90A

MSTA-SM2 :

New ex italian IVECO ACM 80/90 4x4 medium military trucks now in service with two ukrainian army brigades :

H.P.

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Kraken?

As far as the Ukrainian Army getting and training up on a western MBT, they have already done such retraining with western artillery systems- M109, PzH 2000, HIMARS, Gepard, etc. Who’s to say that a tank battalion can’t be pulled off the line, sent to Poland to get up to speed on a new western MBT, then sent back into battle?

Looks like a Turkish ACV-15 AAPC, which is license-copy of the US made AIFV. The Koreans make a similar vehicle, the K200A1.