OK, so if I wrote that I absolutely despised you and the way you go about model building, but your completed models were well made, you would take that to mean that I did not have an issue with you as a person or as a modeler? My recognition that your finished product was first-rate would make you forget about my burning hatred for you and your modeling philosophy, is that what you are saying?
I read the words you wrote, assuming that you wouldn’t have stated it if you didn’t believe it. Or maybe there was some kind of deeper meaning buried in that sentence.
You despise, dislike, do not prefer, or are ambivalent to rivet counters. So what? Acknowledging that they make good models doesn’t mean you like the way they interact with others or go about their modeling. If you don’t like them - as you so plainly stated - live with it. You are allowed to have that opinion.
I still have three questions though:
Why must the legitimacy of criticism depend on the critic’s ability to model themselves, or their willingness to post photos?
Why do you even pay attention to what others, rivet counters in particular, do or say in their modeling?
Why does it seem that it is always “fun” builders starting threads like this or criticizing rivet counters, when threads started by rivet counters criticizing fun builders are virtually non-existent?
More likely, they chose to address one aspect of the original post without delving into the issues raised by it’s prefacing paragraphs. Don’t assume “didn’t want to get into it” means “understood an unstated thought” .
About the type of person the original poster was referring to.
“On the one hand I despise the know it all type who is quick to point out errors or omissions but who never or rarely show his own work. If you’re gonna talk the talk you’d better walk the walk”.
There is a mile of difference between a nice rivet counter and an obnoxious one.
There is the nice person who uses their own leisure time to politely inform someone else about improvements that can be made, errors that can be fixed, omissions that can corrected by using parts or products from X, Y or Z source et.c.
The other type hands out negative comments without providing any improvement suggestions.
This type could be called “drive-by commenting”.
I have told model builders at contests why they didn’t get better results. Some simple things like ‘get the road wheels in line’ , 'That missed injection gate cost you two points".
There are others here who have a ton of knowledge and shares it, they give and take.
I have met one of the obnoxious ones at the model railroad club I used to be a member of.
Don’t know if he was a member or a regular visitor but he spent twenty minutes talking about how to build a Swedish D-class electric locomotive correctly and had lots to say about how another members model was incorrect in various aspects.
I finally got a word in sideways and smilingly asked him to bring along his own model of that locomotive so that we all could get a good look at how it should be done.
He changed the subject and then I didn’t see him again for a couple of months.
He had no “positive energy” to share, it was all whine and complain for twnety minutes until I shut his face. Other members had had similar experiences with that guy.
Some of the other posts hint at similar experiences. In some cases there has been “know-it alls” who didn’t (i.e. know Jack Sh*t).
People can be a lot of things but they shouldn’t be a-holes about it.
Count your rivets and be happy but don’t p*ss on others.
Build OOB to get something finished and into the display cabinet but leave those who want to “go all in” with their models do their thing.
Hmmm. Now you’re just recycling thoughts from other threads.
Come on guys - Once again Kurt is right and everybody else is wrong. Haven’t you noticed? Whenever there’s a virtual pissing contest in the forum, Kurt is almost always one of the parties involved - spearheading the effort to guide us toward truth and enlightenment. If only more such warriors existed in real life.
And again you read into this post what isn’t there.
This is not a singular occurrence. One only needs to read this one thread from M-L to sum up the usual interaction with KL. Not only is he the self appointed arbiter for what should be considered appropriate content and box art manipulation, he schools us on when laughter is not appropriate. In a thread where no one was laughing. Not with emojis. Not with “ROFL” or “ha ha.” No one.
But the true insult is that he would attempt to edify us (soldiers who have actually served) with this:
.…but surely you realize that in both cases the philosophies and actions of the two governments and their rulers, and the widespread actions of their military commanders and fellow soldiers makes empathy for individual soldiers nearly impossible and sympathy for their families very hard to muster.
Firstly, I neither need nor desire to be told what I need to realize. After all I do not reside in Oceania. Secondly, that mischaracterization of soldiers is, for true soldiers at least, an insult.
Empathy is a human emotion (for most) regardless of profession. Clearly such a statement demonstrates a lack of the very same. Soldiers are not monsters, nor are we mindless robots, drinking Kool-Ade without even knowing what flavor it is. In fact, SF soldiers certainly have more highly developed empathy skills than your average internet warrior. Of course Kurt’s experience in SF may be different than my own. I have had tremendous respect for most of my adversaries on the battlefield. I do not revel in their deaths, nor do I wish grief upon their families. (Although Chingiz Khan did leave us with one of the more memorable quotes of all time) The thing to remember is that modern day soldiers are not thugs or members of the Golden Horde. So please don’t speak for us.
The statement in question was in regard to the Nazis in WW II and current Russian government, and the widespread, inhuman, criminal, actions of their soldiers. If 18bravo is intending to argue that the Wehrmacht Heer troops (not to mention SS) who time and again photographed themselves murdering civilians and the Russian troops who slaughtered hundreds in Bucha or Mariupol, who knowing fired ballistic missiles into occupied apartment buildings, don’t forever tarnish the reputations of their armies and their countries, I will let him. If he means to say that that these criminals still warrant the same professional and public respect that honorable soldiers deserve, I won’t stand in his way. I cannot, however muster sympathy for murders or their families.
" Hans Asperger was born in Hausbrunn, Austria, and raised on a farm not far from the city.[11] The eldest of three sons, Asperger had difficulty finding friends and was considered a lonely, remote child.[12][13] He was talented in language; in particular, he was interested in the Austrian poet Franz Grillparzer, whose poetry he would frequently quote to his uninterested classmates. He also liked to quote himself and often referred to himself from a third-person perspective.[12]
As a youth, he joined the Wandering Scholars of the Bund Neuland, a conservative Catholic organization within the German Youth Movement. He considered this a formative experience, later stating: “I was molded by the spirit of the German youth movement, which was one of the noblest blossoms of the German spirit.”[14]
I made my reply with pretty much the same understanding of your original comments as Kurt has expressed. That is, my understanding is that you said exactly what you intended to say. Frankly, I took your comments and criticisms to be directed squarely at me and everyone like me and the way we like to build and enjoy the hobby.
However, to be fair, perhaps you didn’t intend to include ALL modelers who enjoy adding extra details and correcting kit errors, or ALL the modelers who enjoy doing in-depth research and study of the subjects they are building. Perhaps your issue is ONLY with modelers who you perceive to be critical without having any credibility about what they’re saying, their credibility somehow being measured by how much of their own work they post up here on these forums.
If this was the case, then perhaps using a term like “rivet counters” in a pejorative manner to include pretty much everybody who does anything other than build OOTB is the crux of the communication problem here.
However, I might also submit that if there has been any failure to clearly communicate just what you actually intended to write that failure does not rest with the audience who can only read the words that you, yourself, wrote.
M1A2 SEP v2: 64600 kg
Volume or mass scale: 1/ (35 x 35 x 35) = 1/42875
Scale weight: 64600 kg / 42875 = 1.5 kg (needs a lot of lead pellets to get the proper weight)